Diana Smith, VP, Market Leader at Endeavor Business Media

A lot of people think, "Oh my gosh, AI, this big bad, you know, everything's going to be automated. There's always going to be a process." And it's really, it's a tool. and being able to use that tool and implement it within our lives. How much easier and better it is going to be able to support all of us, especially in our media careers. Today we have an awesome guest. We have Diana Smith and she's VP and market leader for Endeavor Business Media. So, welcome to the show, Diane. I'm really glad to have you on.

>> Thank you so much, Richard. I'm so happy to be here, >> man. Well, you know, we have a tradition on the Above the Clouds podcast where we ask our guests, a real stumper, and the first question is, what's your spirit bird? Meaning, if your company was a bird, what kind of bird would it be and why? So, when I think about this, I you know, recently I just read the book, the Harry Potter series with my daughter. >> Oh, so good. >> I love those books and they it was a lot of fun to do that with her. But when I think about this question, I keep on going back to the Phoenix because I love the story where Dumbledore is like, "Fox, if you would just hurry up and just die, we would get done with it and then you can come back to life." And and I think that that's how I see business and then that's how I would equate my spirit bird to would be the phoenix because we all have ups and downs and it's just a matter of how fast we can get through and the resiliency that we have.

>> Man, that's a good one. That is uh I think you're the first mythical bird. >> I know. Then I was thinking about that. I was like, well, do we want to I mean, does it have to be a real real bird? Do I have to pick a card? >> No, I love it. I love it. I think that the, you know, Phoenix is such a is a such a great metaphor for business as you said, like, you know, think about, you know, you and I have both been in the industry for a while. Think about all the times that, you know, your career, you just you restart your career.

You know, it's really interesting. Every new job is a whole new beginning and, >> you know, you still have all that retained knowledge, but it feels like you're starting all over again. So, it's really, and to me, that's the most exciting thing. you know, think about all the the, you know, twists and turns, you know, we've had in our our careers is the, you know, when digital first came out and print was going to go away, right? >> And then it didn't. Print got twice as big and then the internet and then, you know, all these different, you know, changes in the the media landscape that you've you've seen.

>> Exactly. Exactly. And I think that, you know, it's not only I always at the beginning of each year I have a meeting with uh my entire team and we talk about, you know, what we see happening, you know, and I tell everyone, you know, do whatever you need to do, but we've got to get your crystal ball out, whatever you need to do. Um, but think about what that future is going to look like so that we can be in front of whatever is potentially what we think is going to happen. No one knows what's going to happen.

But just like the internet and uh like you said print, but it's not only the media industry, it's also the industries we support, >> right? >> So whether it be the oil and gas or power utilities or whatever those markets are. >> Yeah, absolutely. You're right too. Every year for if you're in sales is a um it's a definitely a all new year. You have a whole new quota and you know every month's a new start over new start >> every month, every quarter, every year. >> Yeah. Oh my gosh. Well, you know, I've obviously known you for a long time, but why don't you walk talk to our listeners and um walk them through your career and and and how you got here in your new position?

>> Well, so my career originally started I worked at I'm originally from Akran, Ohio. So, I was working at a PR agency in Cleveland and uh we ran a media room for one of the conferences that we worked with. And I had a publisher that came up to me and said, "Hey, I need a salesperson." And I said, "Well, that's good for you." And he said, "Well, why don't you why don't you just come down to Houston, Texas, and at least look at the job?" And I said, "Well, I don't you know, I'm not I'm I don't want to go into sales." And he's like, "Well, it's a free trip to Houston." And I said, "Well, it's not on my bucket list." >> Yeah, it's summertime.

I don't want to go. >> It's summer time, right? >> That's the last place I want to go. >> No. And so, I mean, obviously, we're here in Houston, Texas now, and so I think we know what happened with that role, but I started um selling for Trailer Bodybuilders um magazine, which is the trucking and transportation industry um for at that time Penton Media. And this is what's interesting is that Penton Media was purchased. It then became Informa and then is now Endeavor. >> Oh wow. >> So I started with Trailer Bodybuilders.

That's still in our portfolio at Endeavor Business Media. But from there from um >> full circle >> full it's full circle and I started into oil and gas uh markets right after that about 5 years after I was um with Penton and then went into management about 8 to 10 years ago with Eastern Chronicle and then um with another oil and gas an international oil and gas brand and saw this position was available and um went back to my roots and as the market leader for the energy group at Endeavor. >> That's amazing.

You know, we hear so many times with our guests. So many of our guests, they they didn't start off wanting to be in sales or marketing. >> You know, maybe they were engineers or they did something else. Even my career, I didn't I never wanted to go into sales and somehow >> I wound up in sales and uh and you know, tell me about tell me about that feeling when you were like there's no way I want to do sales. Like what was going through your mind? I was like, well, and I guess that it comes from, you know, whatever your background or your experience is, and you're thinking to yourself, well, I can't have like a commissionbased job.

I don't know what I can't I have to have something that's stable and I can depend on it every month. >> Sure. >> And you're thinking, oh my gosh. And then you start thinking about it. And I think that sa good salespeople especially have a very entrepreneurial spir spirit. >> Sure. and making sure that you know you're finding salespeople on your team that have that because I've always looked at it as my business and how can I run and make my business more successful. >> But and I think that that's where it comes from is really there's no way I'm doing this and then you find out, oh my gosh, you get that first commission check and you're like, holy cow.

>> Yeah. >> What was I thinking? >> Exactly. Like what if I sold 10 times as much? Yeah. That's what you want. You want the you want them looking at that upside and not the the downside. I think and I think that's a great way of thinking about it because sales people you have to pretty have a a strong mindset and be um risk tolerant. Right. Right. And if you and if they're only focusing on the fact that they might not make their commission. That is definitely not the right headsp space for a salesperson to be in.

>> Right. Right. I mean there's that fear factor, but it's like how you have to look at the bigger picture on how we can grow. What are the what's the strategy that you're going to put in place in order to set yourself up for success? Not just today, but as we were saying, next month, next quarter, next year, over the next five years. What is that going to be? >> Yeah, for sure. That is you got to kind of plot it along. >> Right. Right. Um, well, tell me tell me about your day-to-day job now because you're, you know, you're the VP over there and you are you got a lot of responsibilities.

So, you know, tell me about a day in the life of of Diana Smith. >> You know, I I say that I have the best job. I absolutely love what I do because I get to interact with our editorial team as well as the sales team. And with the fact that I have the oil and gas group as well as the power utility. So both I have a couple of brands that are very international brands. >> Yeah. >> And so I get to have the international sales team as well. and being able to deal on a global basis with the international people as well as the North American sales reps as well as the editorial team and then um our customer marketing and our audience development.

That's my day is making sure all of these pieces are coming together in order to fulfill the strategy that we have in place in order to move our business forward. >> Yeah. How do you like the editorial side? >> I love the editorial side because my background was PR. So, I feel like I >> I understand the editorial team and all of the challenges that they have a little bit better than someone who might come in that is very sales focused. >> Yeah, that's right. And I think, you know, being able to, you know, put your stamp on that, too, and say, "Here's what, you know, having the customer in mind, like here's what here's what our our clients are concerned about right now, >> right?

Maybe you could do some, you know, take an angle on that, you know, >> and that's, yeah, that's very much what we do as well at Endeavor. We have a we have an internal uh thought process called the blue triangle where we're trying to make sure that everything comes together and making sure that the editorial team is supporting the audience that our customers are trying to reach. >> Sure. Yeah. >> So, your customers customers >> our customers customer. Yes. Yeah, >> all of the everyone in that entire life cycle, if you will, to make sure that we're drawing and bringing in those those audiences.

>> Talk to us about some of the brands that are underneath the Endeavor Media um umbrella because I think our a lot of our listeners will probably know many of them. >> I'm sure they would. You know, the great thing is is that Endeavor, I mean, we have over a hundred different media brands. We have over 60 different events. So in the oil and gas sector we have oil and gas journal and offshore. Those are under my purview as well as TND world which is the power utility side. We also have I said trailer bodybuilders.

We have a dental brand. We have uh buildings in construction for both the residential as well as the commercial side of the business. So our media goes as well as processing brands and manufacturing. So, we have so many different brands that I think we really and truly cover just about every industry that's pretty much out there. >> That is so cool. You know, with my background, I definitely knew um Oil and Gas Journal for sure and Offshore, great uh great magazines for sure. >> And um and I've still call them magazines brands, but you know, but I know there's so much more than that, >> right?

Uh, you know, it's so good to um think about how the media has changed because I think, you know, it wasn't that long ago that we were, you know, whenever I was working with media and the the trade journals and they were really all about selling a printed page >> and and I kept thinking, guys, this is the world has changed, but they had that model so ground in their heads, but now you look at the way like you guys especially are doing things and you've got so any you know you you've broadened so much beyond just the print magazine.

>> Yeah. The and the print magazine it's like that's just one in my opinion very small piece of the pie. There's so many other things that we can do to help our customers get their message out not only to the audience that they're trying to reach but being able to make sure that they accomplish their marketing goals and objectives. because really and truly at the end of the day it's about them and what it is that they need. So >> yeah, that's cool. And I know like some of your some of your videos and things like that that you guys are doing really have branched out and it's really is is amazing content.

>> The I mean it's not only the videos but it's also our podcasts that we have. So within my group alone, we have three podcasts and the one uh oil and gas journal has the oil and gas reenterprise, but on the TND World brand, the podcast there, we have TND World Live, but the really exciting and fun one is Line Life. And we actually have conversations with line workers. >> Oh, that's cool. >> And what they experience because I mean, especially being here in Houston, we know we're going to lose power.

>> Yeah. >> I mean, at some point throughout the year. >> Yeah. Whether it's for a couple hours or a couple of days, couple weeks >> like last year. >> Exact right. And a couple of different times. >> Yeah. Exactly. >> So, you know, having those podcasts and being able to tell those stories of really and truly what a day in the life is of these people and, you know, what they have to go through. It's it's really interesting and it's a lot of it's it's great to hear that. >> I The linemen have some really >> they have some good stories.

>> Great stories. >> Yes. And the we also have um we work with the lineman's rodeo. It's in Kansas City every year. And >> Oh, I didn't know there was such a thing. >> It's so cool. They go to um Kansas City and the linemen compete and they call it the lineman's rodeo. Like we have the rodeo here, but this is a rodeo where they have to climb. Yeah. >> But they have to have an egg in their mouth as they're climbing the pole. And if they crack it, they're automatically disqualified. >> Wow. Yeah, >> that would be fun to watch.

>> It's fun. Yeah, it's fun. >> They get to bring their families and their families cheer for them and all that. >> Yes. It's a very family oriented event. >> Wow. That Who knew? All right. I need tickets to that. I'm going. >> Yes. Yes. Come on. >> Get some Kansas City barbecue. >> Right. Right. October this year. >> I love it. I love it. Um, let me So, how long have you been in this new role? I've been with Endeavor for about two and a half years now. >> Two and a half years. So that's that's enough time. You got it all figured out now.

But >> all of it. >> What What is uh what's one thing you know now that you wish you would have known on day one? >> You know, I think that and I think that this kind of goes back to what we were talking about in the beginning is about media and the changes. >> I think the world of media is changing so fast. And I think with the adoption of AI if I would have known how AI was actually and I think that you know a lot of people think oh my gosh AI this big bad you know everything's going to be automated there's always going to be a process and it's really it's a tool and being able to use that tool and implement it within our lives how much easier and better it is going to be able to support all of us especially in our media careers.

>> Yeah. Well, you think about all the everybody thinks about the when they think about the media, they think about the, you know, front cover of a magazine or the podcast or whatever, but there's a lot of boring and tedious work. >> Right. Right. >> Also, that needs to get done, right? >> Yes. Yes. Think about putting those scripts together and things like that for the webinars we do and, you know, finding questions that, you know, the editorial team can ask of, you know, when they're doing their interviews and things.

There's a lot of different there's a lot of good things that they can implement as well as proofreading. >> Yeah, for sure. Right. Oh my god, I'm dyslexic. So, >> right, >> you know, AI and you know, Grammarly and, you know, all the different things have really like saved my bacon. Really? I couldn't if I would have grown up in the era of this typewriters, I would have been my career would have been pretty short. I've been probably a plumber. Oh, yeah. That's great. So um how are you guys using AI at the at the magnet?

Are you using for efficiency gain? Are you using it for content creation or are you using it how how are you guys using it? >> So we use the AI on the editorial team really is for efficiency and then any of our editorial content we run it through AI. So it's kind of like a um an an editorial intern. >> Yeah. because we do we have a great editorial team that has you know over a hundred years of experience just within my group and that you know historical knowledge and industry information you're not going to get that >> through necessarily an AI tool however it can learn that >> yeah so did you train it on your voice and and and your editorial style and all that training the agent on there being worked on Wow That is so cool when you're able to do that and you can run it through your you know your voice and everything and just you you when you see the results of something that's been really an AI that's really been trained well >> you go wow it I can't you can't distinguish that it was not written by a human you know it's pretty amazing >> right >> yeah efficiency is what we are using AI for too at our company just because um you we're small lean team and our clients ask want you know they want us to do a lot of work and so it's really good to help us to be a lot more efficient and um you know limit human error >> and that's really I mean I think that that's the big piece of the AI puzzle is limiting human error.

>> Yeah. >> Because we all make mistakes. >> Sure. Yeah. And if we can have something that we can just, you know, run an email through to say, "Hey, you know, you know, add a comma here." I mean, that comma could have changed a lot of things. >> Yeah. Let's eat, grandma. >> Right. >> Let's eat grandma. >> Exactly. >> Very different. >> Oh, man. So, you know, you it's interesting since you're a work of the editorial team and you're a marketer and you're doing sales. What do you see as the biggest obstacles you guys are facing from a sales and marketing perspective in your in your industry?

>> I mean, I think every industry always has obstacles. I think that for us, it's just about streamlining processes and making sure that we are following those processes. You know, it's like the pipelines. I mean, you go to sales, you've got pipelines, you know, marketing people. They're trying to make sure that the content that they're producing is resonating with our clients. And then you talk about AI, and it's like, you know, there are AI tools that can help you with subject lines so that your emails can get open fast.

So, it's like, how do we implement all of these things? And I think that technology is moving so quickly that it's really hard to keep up with that. And so, that's a big challenge. I think that any industry, but I I think especially media and especially what we're facing. >> Yeah, I can imagine. You know, we we run into the same thing. You know, we we're always looking for, you know, I guess marketers, we love shiny new things always. And so, we're always looking for some cool technology and some cool AI, you know, tool.

And, you know, our team brings them all the time like, hey, let's try this, let's try that. And uh you cannot build a process or have any kind of governance when you're introducing a new tool every week, >> right? >> And by the way, I'm one of the worst offenders uh at that. So, you know, it's it is uh I think we >> I'm not naturally a process person, but we have people in our organization that definitely are and they're they were really bothered by it. So, >> but it is a challenge. It is an obstacle for sure, >> right?

Because if you have too you have to have that fine line because too many processes you lose the creativity. >> Yeah. >> Whereas if you have no no guard rails at all then things start getting lost. So you have to have that balance. >> You do have to have the balance. You know I feel like um I I remember getting into an argument earlier in my career with my boss and he was like we got to get our processes straight here and I was like I don't even like our output now. like let's let's get a good product, right?

>> And then we'll build processes around that. If we build a process now, we're going to get a lousy product, >> right? Right. We have got the chicken and the egg here. >> Yeah. It's like let's get the let's build let's build something we like first, >> right? >> And then build a process to consistently be able to deliver that. >> Exactly. Exactly. >> What would you say is the biggest misconception about your industry? >> Would are you asking from media endeavor or from like oil and gas? media and media. Well, why don't do both?

You're an expert on both of this. Start with me. Start with Endeavor in the media industry. >> I think that the media industry people I think in today's society, we've got so many influencers, so many people that are out there that are media experts. >> Yeah. >> And it's kind of like, well, you know, who is the expert then? If everyone's an expert, no one's an expert. >> Sure. Yeah. Yeah. So, I think that it's about touting the credibility especially of our editorial teams of the content that we're producing, their knowledge, their industry knowledge, and where they come from and their backgrounds and histories because they've been following these markets for a very, very long time, whatever they've whichever market they've become the subject matter expert within.

>> Yeah. No, that's a really good point. you know, um, any any fool with a microphone including me. >> I'm right here with you. >> No, that's right. That's a really good point because if you've been following this industry for, you know, for so long, you know, I've spoken to your, you know, to editors at at different train publications and um, and I've always been impressed with their knowledge and and I think having that history. >> Yeah. >> Right. It's like, oh, this is just like when uh in 1995, >> right?

>> Like, wow, that's good to have some money with that kind of depth, >> right? And it's so funny because I have one of one of our editors actually is because we have we actually have our old magazines. >> Mhm. >> That are in a warehouse. >> Oh my gosh. >> Dating back. >> We have some oil and gas journal magazines that are bound copies from like the 1920s. >> Oh my goodness. And I had an editor ask, "Well, can I go in and take a look at all this historical data?" Like, they actually go back and research this stuff >> when they're getting ready to prepare a piece.

So, it's not like And they know where to look as well as the interesting piece of it. >> Yeah. Really? And you know, when you're talking about those old magazines, I envision in my head of that scene from Indiana Jones. >> Yes. >> You know, the massive warehouse. >> Yeah. It's pretty cool, >> man. That's cool. Maybe you can use AI to build a whole library of that knowledge. That would be pretty cool. >> It would be. It would be. >> Oh man. Well, what about the oil and gas industry? What do you What do you in the energy industry as a whole?

What do you think is the uh and >> Well, I mean, I think that the biggest obstacle is the fact that whether it be like the energy industry. So, I think that, you know, whether it be whoever your utility is, >> your electric utility company, they get a bad rap for not being able to be ahead of the game. But you never know, especially like in Houston, we never know what what storm is going to yield the results. >> And I mean, in Center Point, the last, you know, when they had the when we had our last storm, Barrel, they had electricity and power back in record time.

>> Yeah. >> And >> except my neighborhood for some reason. Right. Right. Like come on. >> So I think that you know that whe whatever industry it is that they you know they're under a microscope in so many ways. Oil and gas is kind of like the big fat oil and gas industry but oil and gas is the industry that is creating all of these new technologies for uh whether we say green energy or energy transition. They're they're at the forefront of that. So I think that a lot of these industries are getting a lot of um negative negativity around them whereas I think that we have to also do a better job of telling our story.

>> Yeah. I think that the oil and gas industry is an industry that um did not do a very good job of telling their story and they just kind of let they let other people control the narrative about the about the industry and what and about uh energy and what's clean and what's not clean and you know all these things and um I I wish they you know would do a better job of saying yeah but hold on you know have you considered this have you considered this you Because if you look at if you look at some of the countries in Europe that have undergone undergone some of these clean energy policies uh it's really hurt their economy it's hurt their people you know look at Germany it you really going through a tough time they were a man the Europe's manufacturing powerhouse >> right >> and now with expensive uh energy and a unreliable grid you know they're really struggling and and I hate to see that because it's a great country you know >> right and I know that in the UK they had to um fire up the coal plants last winter.

>> Yeah. So you go, "Wow, that's not um I'll take natural gas any day." >> Right. Right. >> Over coal. >> Yes. Yes. It's a conversation. >> It's a It should be a conversation where they can have that dialogue and say, "Look, you know, sure, there's >> clean hydrogen would be great or uh you know, >> wind energy. >> Yeah. when you know all these other things but but there's >> there's no silver bullets >> right >> uh everything has its pluses and its negatives and um >> you know it takes carbon to produce those wind turbines right >> and and I say you know the silver bullet that we have are our people >> especially in the oil field for sure I think that you know I've run across so many really intelligent people in the companies I've worked with in the past and you just go wow this is really interesting and you know the international >> Yes.

>> aspect of it is really, you know, you really just get to meet some of the best and brightest people from around the world >> and they truly care. >> Yeah. You know, when you think about caring in your industry, you know, um being able to care about your indust, you know, the industries that you guys are serving is part of it. How do you guys uh how do you guys manage for that and look for that in in a company like Endeavor? Well, I think that it's a matter of finding out what people love and what they really sort of gravitate to.

>> So, one of my sales people uh we one of the brands I have is Energy Tech, which is um more on the energy transition side for the commercial industrial side of the industry. But uh he was had so many different brands that he was working with and he was selling all of these different things and and I said his love was really on the renewable side and that energy tech side and then we also have another brand Micro Grid Knowledge and and I said you know let's focus on these two brands this year. >> Yeah.

>> Let's pull it back. Let's pull things back because sometimes it's about opening things up for more opportunities. Sometimes it's well, we have to have a focus. >> Sure. Yeah. >> And this guy has taken this territory and he has run full force into it. >> And I think it's really about identifying what people are good at. >> Sure. >> Because normally if someone's good at something, guess what? They love it. >> Yeah. Absolutely. So, >> and vice versa. If they love it, then they'll pretty good at it, >> right?

>> Let me ask you this. Where do you see the media industry going over the next 5 to 10 years? >> Oh, that's been a big conversation over the past couple of days that we've had internally. Um, I think that the media industry is going to over the next five years, I think it's going to evolve. It's in a constant evolution. I don't think that AI is one of the um is it's going to stop with AI and I think that AI is going to evolve and we're going to have another technology probably within the next 3 to 5 years.

But the biggest thing that I see for marketers as well as our clients is uh the search functionality. M >> I think that search functionality and our C I shouldn't say I say this but our CEO was saying that some of the stuff that he's read the some of the stuff that he has been taking a look at so I'm borrowing from his phrase is that search functionality is really going to uh drop >> and it's about and that organic traffic is going to drop. So, how do we continue to help our clients meet those buyers and finding out what that buyer intent is >> and being able to so one of our products, personify, which I think that you are a little bit familiar with, but having that AI technology on the back end in order to be able to support driving traffic to someone's site based on the content that we have out there.

Yeah, that you know that is something we see with our uh our clients is we were looking at their um at everybody's data you know that what you know keywords are bringing them bringing people to the website and what the traffic looks like >> and um all of them had a dip about the same time >> right >> and we were like what the heck happened in this time the first time we saw we're like what happened did you guys do this did you do that uh and we're trying to figure out why the dip and And we saw it with another customer and another customer.

We saw it with our own data. And that is that dip coincided with when Google started putting the AI um >> uh synopsis right >> at the top of the right at the top, >> right? >> And so you go, "Wow, that uh that really knocked a dent." And I was at a conference the other day and they said that reduced overall search traffic by 30%. >> Yeah. >> And that's just today. Imagine what it's going to be. next year at this time. >> Yeah. >> So, we should do a followup. >> Yeah. Well, it makes you wonder, you know, you think how what what uh what's head of Google's way with that, you know, I think there's going to be a whole group of people >> who don't even think to Google something, >> right?

They're just going to ask it directly to chat GPT or whatever they use. Yeah. They're just going to say, "Hey, what about this?" >> Right. >> And um yeah, they're not going to search and go to a website. they're going to get that answer right in their ear. So, it's really interesting times cuz you know, man, five years ago, >> oh heck, two years ago, you would have thought, well, Google's just they've cornered search. They won. Like, I know I know Bing's out there and you know, all that other but like let's just face it.